Transcription of Nan Lu, OMD for the show East Meets West #28
Dr. Lisa: Today’s featured guest is an individual who I hold in very high esteem and wanted to interview despite the fact that we would be making a phone call rather than our usual practice of doing it in person. This is Dr. Master Nan Lu who is the founder and director of the Traditional Chinese Medicine World Foundation in New York. I know you’re going to enjoy this interview.
Good morning Master Lu. How are you?
Master Nan Lu: Good morning. How are you?
Dr. Lisa: I am doing well. Thank you so much for agreeing to come on the Dr. Lisa Radio Hour and podcast with us today. The show that we’re doing this week is called East-West, and we will also be having a more traditional Western trained physician on with us. As a Chinese medicine physician, we are interested in how you came to be doing what you are doing, and we wanted to get a little bit of background about Chinese traditional medicine from you.
Master Nan Lu: Let me start it this way. Try the Tao way. We know that Western medicine, any kind of medicine, always has theories, has basis, has the science behind it. So the Chinese medicine is a different kind of framework. They are not based on the Western medicine, that kind of framework. They are based on the other kind, which is, as of today modern science has discovered, what you call a quantum information system.
If you look at the quantum information systems, they tell that everything are connected to each other. That is at the basis of quantum theories. So these kind of theories have been applied and used in Chinese medicine for thousands of years. One of the famous theories in Chinese medicine, we call the 5 elements theories. There are five basic elements, which means we can say one is the wood element, one is the fire element, one is the earth element, and the metal elements and the water element.
Generally speaking, the Chinese believe that the whole universe, the Earth, can be simply divided into these five basic elements. All of these elements are communicating and connect to each other. In this system then, the Chinese medicine applies for the human body, human organs, and the natures, everything into this system. Everything is connected to each other.
For example, if we say you have a liver function disorder, if you think of a way you go to the Western test, they say ‘Oh, your liver may be better to live with. Okay. The tests show you’re pretty okay.” But however, you have many different kind of symptoms associated with the liver function disorder, for example. Like menstrual system may experience the breast tenderness, major cramp, and emotional mood swings, all of these are symptoms. According to Chinese medicine, they are associated with the liver function, so that’s why the Chinese medicine will say “Because if the liver function disorder will cause you to have these symptoms.” So to eliminate the symptoms, or treat the symptoms, you have to treat the liver function. Otherwise you just cover the symptoms.
Let me give you another example, called a relationship problem. Like today, we see so many people suffer acid reflux. That’s one of the common conditions. In Chinese medicine, when we look at these symptoms, we would diagnose this as a relationship problem, which means its the stomach and the liver function relationship problem. Generally speaking, the liver function disorder that causes the stomach function disorder. So in order to eliminate these symptoms, you have to treat both organs. Making these systems function in harmony can allow… symptoms can be eliminated.
That is generally speaking about Chinese medicine. They use a different framework to look at the relationship.
Dr. Lisa: Chinese medicine can really remedy people’s chronic ailments in a way that Western medicine hasn’t really achieved at this point. Not the acute infections and disasters that happen, but chronic illnesses that seem to be taking such a toll on Americans.
Master Nan Lu: Chinese medicine, I think we cannot say that because Chinese medicine only can deal with acute conditions. But also can deal acute conditions. Like for example, if you did a heart attack in the middle of the street, you get a heart attack, I think Chinese medicine is better than any kind of medicine with acupuncture needles. So if you like, before the end you come here, and go back to the hospital, get the heart needle, you might die. Right?
Dr. Lisa: Right.
Master Nan Lu: If you look at this kind of concept, but the most important thing we have to look at them, is another what medicine is, what kind of framework do you use to look into the human body? That’s what today’s science, science already proves, already shows us, everything is about energy up to date. At the atomic level, or the subatomic level. Everything are changeable. Everything is about energy. So therefore it doesn’t matter what kind of medicine, it means who can understand the relationship with energy, who will be able to have a good result.
Dr. Lisa: Dr. Lu, one of the things that I know that you focus on is the practice of Qigong. As a medical Qigong student of yours, and also a teacher of the Dragon’s Way class, I’ve found great benefit of this, for this to my patients. How did you come to be a Qigong practitioner and master yourself?
Master Nan Lu: Well, I had been trained by many many masters, and the thing we heard about Chi gong is one kind of energy property. Which means basic special energy properties will allow us to discover who we are, allow us to connect to the life force. Generally speaking, we all have energy, so we all know inside it has a life of force. And how can we use this life of force wisely at the body-mind-spirit level. So through my many years, the experience I rediscovered, which my Masters tell me, that I have to practice and find Qigong – it is one of the Chinese ways to discover the life force. In use of this kind of life force, you can help the body achieve the balance, and also you can using these energy properties to deal with many different kinds of physical conditions.
Dr. Lisa: Dr. Lu, what have you seen are the indicators of a healthy balanced human being?
Master Nan Lu: Well when most people come to me they aren’t in balance. If they are in balance, they are not going to come to me. So that’s why I haven’t seen a good one yet.
Dr. Lisa: Are there any indicators of imbalance?
Master Nan Lu: Sure, they can see, there are so many signs. As of today, we know everything about the signs. The most important thing as of today, the people listening, if they are listening, so they believe the modern science, you have to believe energy maps are interchangeable. And whatever will we see is the energy. So therefore, energy will have a sign. Let me give you an example. If you see your nail is not as shiny, it has many lines. Your nail is difficult to grow. You have a nail problem. The nail condition is associated with the liver function – that’s the sign. And also I see the breast tenderness – that’s the sign of the liver function disorder. That also is the sign. I can give you other signs.
Okay, suppose you have osteoporosis, high loss of bone loss. And many people might take some calcium pills and try to eliminate the bone loss. However, in Chinese medicine that’s the sign of kidney function disorder. Even the simple way, where we say that you have a knee problem, suppose you have a knee pain and are suffering and you might need a knee replacement. You might need a knee surgery, whatever you need. That’s the sign of kidney function disorder. There are many signs in our human body. You just have to understand the relationship between the human body and the organs and the mind and emotions.
Dr. Lisa: Master Lu, I know that a focus of your practice has been on women, and you’ve done work with breast health, and there are a lot of women that have done the Dragon’s Way, and other programs that you have put forth. Why is it so important to work with women and their energy levels?
Master Nan Lu: Let me make a joke. In the Chinese culture, the woman is 50% of the heaven. The woman is the most important one of the group of people, and also particularly in the Western society, women have more stress than the men. In my opinion, that’s what I think.
Because most of the women carry many masks. They have to carry the perfect mother, the perfect wife, the perfect job, so they wear so many masks they have to carry on. So that is difficult for women. And also, on the other hand, the Chinese medicine states all women’s health directly or indirectly are associated with the liver’s function. Which means if you can treat the liver function, you can treat almost all the woman’s problems, such as gaining weight, headache, PMS, menstrual cycles, breast cancers. So many conditions are associated with the liver function disorder.
And also women are very sensitive. They are more sensitive than the men somehow, so if they can understand their emotions cause their physical disorders, so if they can control their emotions, or understand how to use their own emotions to deal with conditions, they can achieve total health.
Dr. Lisa: And you believe that Qigong is one way of working with one’s emotions, is that right?
Master Nan Lu: I believe that Qigong is self-revealing truth. So when you learn of something, you can heal yourself, you can help yourself getting better. You can almost like everyone needs to take a shower. Then you have an external shower. But can you do an internal shower?
Genevieve: Can anyone do Qigong?
Master Nan Lu: In my opinion, anyone can do Chi gong. Just as anyone have a depend what kind of physical condition. Some people have a better result, some people have a lesser result.
Dr. Lisa: How many classes do you generally need to take? Is it something that you need to do every week, or…
Master Nan Lu: You need to do it every day. You just have to think of this.
Dr. Lisa: Every day.
Master Nan Lu: Because Qigong is a different kind, unlike any kind of physical exercise. Qigong is a slow motion movement. This movement is trying to stimulate the body to a specific energy frequency. 95% of people never have a chance to restart it.
Genevieve Morgan:Someone can go to one of Lisa’s classes and learned the movements and do them themselves.
Master Nan Lu: That’s right. They have to learn it. It is very difficult to just quit the way and say “Hey, let me do something and just go to the video.” I think that someone can learn a different way. But generally speaking, you have to learn it, and you have to practice every day. And on top of this, it depends on how sensitive you are. And also depends on the stage of your health.
Genevieve Morgan:It sounds like what you’re saying is that the consistency of practice of taking care of oneself is important in maintaining one’s health. That you can’t just go to the doctor once a year and expect yourself to be healthy. That it’s a daily practice.
Master Nan Lu: Well you can go to the doctor once a year, because going to the doctor once a year, do not think the doctors going to fix you. You have to look at and go to the doctor once a year to do the physical test, the physical exam, to check on how much improvement myself. Looks like that is the improvement, that’s the test to show how good you are. Real health is reliant on your own hands. It is very important everybody has to realize you are capable, you’re able to control your own health.
Dr. Lisa: Master Lu, you’ve been doing the traditional Chinese medicine World Conference for more than a decade now, is that true?
Master Nan Lu: Yes.
Dr. Lisa: And what challenges have you found in bringing traditional Chinese medicine and the 5 element or 5 phases approach to the United States?
Master Nan Lu: It’s a challenge. It’s a bridge – how to build this bridge. Because the Western mind is the way – it’s the Western concept – Western mind, most of the Western mind is built on classical signs, and they believe everything that they see. The whole scientific, whatever is called the scientific mind, is based on the classical science which is a Newtonic science of 100 years ago is an old science.
However today, everywhere you go, you go to the hospital, all the tests are based on the modern science. It’s not of the classical signs. So the bridge is the to say hey, the classical signs, yes, make sense. However, the model of science today shows you everything is connected to each other. Now the Chinese medicine is just one of the oldest of continuous properties of medicine that has existed for decades. It has existed for thousands of years, and it is just coming to use.
And even today as the modern science already shows here, that kind of concept, that kind of principle makes sense.
Dr. Lisa: And this is why you’re calling your conference ‘Building Bridges’ because that’s what you’re attempting to do is to bridge the different types of science, classical and modern.
Master Nan Lu: That’s right. That’s why I tried to say it’s the bridge, so use the modern science as the bridge. So that everybody can cross, because if there is a bridge, we are comfortable, we understand. So that’s why I say yes, you go to the hospital, you get an MRI, you get an x-ray. Do you understand what kind of frequency an MRI and x-ray use? They are at the atomic level, so therefore to read this result, you have to be at the atomic level. That is the quantum physics – to understand everything is connected instead of saying everything is disconnected, is individual.
Genevieve: Master Lu, how important are our thoughts and state of mind in maintaining health?
Master Nan Lu: I think the mind is very important and the belief is very important because if you believe you can heal yourself, if you believe, you can maintain health and you’ll be able to turn on your body differently. So your own belief, your own emotions take a major impact for your health. That’s what I see for the most of my patients, and particularly if you deal for the quantitative conditions, you deal with the acute conditions, and it’s very important.
Dr. Lisa: Master Lu, you just returned from China, where you go on a regular basis I think to spend time with your own master. Is that right?
Master Nan Lu: Mmhmm. (Affirmative)
Dr. Lisa: Does this help you maintain your own energy and balance and sense of perspective?
Master Nan Lu: I believe everybody has to continuously learning, because to discover the whole universe is unlimited. To grow is unlimited. So if you have a chance, it means it has to be continuous studies. And sometime in life, you come out of different conditions and its complicated. Being a doctor is the most difficult. I think it’s more difficult than any kind of art, different kind of any kind of taking initiative. Because every patient is an individual. So I often make a joke that the patient comes in. “Have you treated this kind of condition before?” I say ‘No. Because God has only created one of you. How can I duplicate it?”
Dr. Lisa: If some of our listeners have been going to a traditional Western doctor their whole lives, but they’re interested in now going to a Chinese medical doctor, can they do both?
Master Nan Lu: Yes they can do both. Because it’s not to say you can only go Chinese, you cannot go to the West. Because the patient tries the Eastern and the Western way, they just have to understand Eastern and the Western is a different kind of focus. Both ways are right. In the Western way, when they look at the world, they have a way to see, which just means that they are absolutely right from their point of view. The diseases, the illness, the infection – that’s absolutely right.
However, if you go to the Chinese doctor, they changed the different kind of frequency, they change the different kind of point of view. It’s the same condition, but they look at it a different way. They are right too. So the way the patient tries to deal with these kind of conditions, they may have to understand. Some way they may be cooperated together. So for example, if during the chemotherapy, some patient, okay, during the chemotherapy, how can you prevent the immune system from being shut down? How can you prevent the system being destroyed by chemo? So you have to change to a different kind of diet. You have to change a different kind of lifestyle. You have to even if possible do some simple Chi gong exercise. Do the simple breathing. And peace for your mind. And take some different kind of herb.
Dr. Lisa: Is there a place for a spiritual practice, or even a religious practice in maintaining health?
Master Nan Lu: I think a spiritual practice and a religious practice is very important in health. Because in the spiritual level, and the religion practice concept of religion, true religion is spirit. It is to understand you are not just a body. You have to have a fate. You have to have a belief. You have to have compassion and the love. So the love is in all disease, and it’s caused by lack of love. So if you can start loving yourself, then you will be able to deal with any kind of disease and illness.
Dr. Lisa: What are the common health ailments that occur as a result of the Western lifestyle?
Master Nan Lu: The Western lifestyle today causes liver function disorder, the number one is stress. Physical stress and emotional stress. That’s the number one. Today, almost all of the modern disease are associative the liver function disorder. You have to love yourself. We say today a lot of conditions, a lot of disease are associated with genetic problems. Yes that’s true. You know you do have some kind of genetic problems.
However, if you turn on the genetic code, according to the modern science, past connects at both times. Disease and health is the same event on both sides. So if you have disease, you definitely have the wisdom of how to control the disease. Maintaining the healing processing, your job is to find where you can start the healing programs. That’s called loving yourself, if you have to believe yourself, you have to trust yourself, that’s very difficult. That kind of concept has not been taught in the Western society. So even we say you love yourself doesn’t mean doesn’t mean you’re going to buy the car, expensive car. You go out to shop and you do this. You do it. That’s not called love of self. That’s just one angle to feed your emotions and desires. To love yourself means to trust your own inner peace, trust your inner strength, trust your own body.
Dr. Lisa: And it sounds as if loving yourself also means first of all getting to know yourself. And Qigong and some of these things that you’re teaching can help people get to know themselves.
Master Nan Lu: Yes, they can through the meditation, they can even go through the simple breathings, they do. They can lead you to understand they are all connected each other. The energy is, it is their life force.
Dr. Lisa: And when people connect with themselves, is it true that they also become better at connecting with people around them as well?
Master Nan Lu: Yes. That’s right. So if you can connect to yourself, if you are understanding your self, and then you’ll be able to connect to others. Because always they say, you want to love others, but love yourself first.
Dr. Lisa: Well Master Lu, it’s really been a privilege to have you on today. I think anybody who’s talked to me about medical Qigong knows how much esteem I hold you in, so I appreciate your coming on as our first national guest talking to us by telephone. Also thank you for coming on with us right after your trip to China. It’s been a great interview. Thank you.
Master Nan Lu: Thank you.